Today’s interview is with Cathrine (Cathy) Jooste, President of the Business Process Outsourcing Division, and John Samuel, EVP and CTO, at CGS, a global provider of applications, enterprise learning, customer experience and outsourcing services. Cathy and John join me today to talk about how the BPO/outsourcing business has changed over the last 40 years, the current challenges that the space is facing, how things are evolving, what are the tech and talent implications of these developments and if we are moving to a fully automated customer service future. Finally, they offer a perspective on what they think the future of CX outsourcing might look like.

This interview follows on from my recent interview – The delusion amongst customer service and experience VPs – Interview with Micah Peterson of ProcedureFlow – and is number 479 in the series of interviews with authors and business leaders that are doing great things, providing valuable insights, helping businesses innovate and delivering great service and experience to both their customers and their employees.

NOTE: A big thank you goes out to the folks at CGS for sponsoring my podcast for the coming month.

Now, CGS is a company you might not have heard of.

But, they have been delivering brand-building and customer experiences for 40 years for global brands that you will definitely have heard of.

Over that time, they have developed deep expertise in both outsourcing and technology, so you should definitely pay attention to what they have to say.

They’ve recently put together a free ebook and video that I’d like to point you to. It’s called The Transformative Power of Generative AI and ChatGPT and has been authored by CGS’ Executive Vice President and Chief Technology Officer, John Samuel (one of our interviewees today). It’s a really comprehensive guide and is designed to deliver insights, summarize research, and inspire creative problem-solving.

Follow this link to check out the free ebook and video.

Here are the highlights of my conversation with Cathy and John:

• There’s been significant change over the years in the diversity of what gets outsourced and the types of things that we asked to support.
• Now, we are partnering with customers on many levels, and it’s not just a voice issue, it’s now our ability to augment our customers through their entire customer service journey.
• In 2011, the Google search for the word contact center surpassed the term of call center in Google search results.
• Research shows that that customer experience and service standards are slipping.
• In the last five years, there are probably three things that have happened that probably would make this statement true:
  • 1. The rapid and massive shift to remote and hybrid working as a result of the pandemic and the fall in agents’ ability to deliver empathetic service due to changes in environment and infrastructure,
  • 2. Changing demands of different demographic (customer) groups, and
  • 3. Skill erosion compounded by massive wage inflation in the global labour market that has made delivering stand-out experiences more difficult to deliver than before.

• The outsourcing industry is going through a bit of an identity crisis right now. Fortunately, I think we’re coming out on the other end and there’s a bright future for us.
• Sometimes, cheap is very expensive i.e. you work so hard with your customer acquisition strategy where you have a phenomenal product or service and you lose the customer because you just weren’t there for them when they needed you.
• When you think about the barriers of entry into the BPO or the outsourcing space, they haven’t been traditionally that big.
• However, given customer demands the barriers are getting bigger and more complex, we think there will be significant consolidation, particularly when we think about the demand for next-generation services, such as generative AI, robotic process automation, process modeling, data science, cyber etc.
• Some of the bigger players are still playing catch up to some extent on this because they’ve not invested and have just been enjoying healthy profits and growth throughout over recent years.
• CGS is incredibly fortunate and equipped for this shift in that we originated out of the tech industry, and our whole company is based on the premise that technology is a critical business enabler. So, we’ve been preparing since our inception for this day.
• We welcome generative AI and the revolution it will usher in because we believe that customer experience will improve with generative AI not go the other way. But, there’s still a need for the human element.
• The BPO CX industry is maturing to be able to handle very complex business interactions. This is allowing banks to focus on banking, healthcare providers to focus on health care, for example, and use outsourcers to do everything else – the customer service, the tech support, some of the back office, accounting transactions and even HR transactions.
• The three trends that are going to cause this major consolidation and reshaping of the BPO industry or the customer experience industry are the demand for next-generation services, geographic reach and the lingual diversity needed.
• Many brands are starting to focus on a core competency model.
• It’s wishful thinking to think that we are on a fast track to a fully automated customer service future.
• The pace at which technology is moving is getting shorter and shorter. But, we don’t see any time in the foreseeable future, where we don’t have human intelligence, compassion and providing a caring service that actually understands what you’re going through in the mix.
• We do see us, however, rapidly adopting leading-edge technology in areas that are going to be less risky to the consumer i.e. inside our contact centers, helping our agents to be much, much better at what they do.
• We have to be intentional about the human and technology balance that we adopt.
• The energy and the passion of the global talent that is available is off the charts. This new generation is unlike anything we’ve ever seen. They can multitask at a rate that will make your head spin.
• The main impact of this is that we as an industry owe it to this next generation to modernize the way that they work, starting with training.
• At CGS, we’re fortunate because we actually have a learning division that spends a lot of time in R&D in this and they are coming up with some really cool things leveraging AI and augmented reality as well as how to make training more modular, more bite-size and gamified.
• If you want to get your customers to become brand advocates and ambassadors, then the contact center becomes a critical part of the process of converting your customers into advocates for your brand.
• The shift from viewing the contact center as a value center rather than a cost center is going to be helped by brands relying more on future-ready BPOs and outsourcers that allow them to focus on their core value proposition.
• One client example, a market leader across various security offerings, is already there relying on CGS to handle all their back office A through Z – sales, professional services, technical support, everything that you could think of that happens in the back office. This allows the client to focus on security offerings. They also leave the innovation to us. We’ve had to disrupt our own business a few different times where we’ve taken out volumes and we’ve automated different things and we’ve gotten more efficient in our own processes. But in the end, we get rewarded as a BPO because the business keeps growing and they keep being successful and we’re along with the ride.
• The new and emerging commercial model for an outsourcer is moving to one that it’s not just about volumes and seats but it’s about the value that you’re delivering and you’re creating. It’s about the relationship and the longevity of it. It’s about true partnership.
• AI is very biased. It is not inclusive, especially when it comes to different languages. Think about the people who built this stuff. It was built around specific languages, typically English and some of the more common languages. So, the technology isn’t there yet.
• I think there’s a lot of room for us to work on improving agent effectiveness by upskilling them using technology i.e. how do we use agent assist to put information at their fingertips much faster, much better, more complete.
• Great one-question survey: Would you hire the person you just spoke to?
• Cathy’s best advice: It all comes down to core values. When you select a partner, it’s much like entering into a marriage. There’s going to be bumps along the way. So, make sure your values are aligned as that will help you navigate the challenges ahead.
• John’s best advice: Partner with companies that are like you, respect you and want to improve your brand. Oh, and make sure they can innovate with you too.

About Cathy

Cathrine (Cathy) Jooste joined CGS in May 2023 as President for the company’s Business Process and Customer Care Outsourcing Division. With over 25 years of experience in consulting, business process and customer care outsourcing industries, Cathy will leverage her consultative, business process and digital transformation expertise along with CGS’ best-in-class technology capabilities to expand the company’s global footprint and deepen relationships to broaden and differentiate the value CGS brings to client business initiatives.

Prior to CGS, Cathy served a dual role and drove record growth as Chief Commercial Officer and North America Region President for Atento. She has also held various leadership positions at renowned companies such as DXC, where she held the post of General Manager for both Consulting and Microsoft Businesses in a global capacity. Her background is complimented with other Tier-1 integrators such as Cognizant, Avanade and Accenture.

Cathy, who hails from South Africa, currently resides in Tampa Bay, Florida along with her husband, twin boys, and their family dog. In her spare time, Cathy enjoys spending time with her family traveling, playing tennis and enjoying a variety of water sports. She received her Bachelor’s Degree in Business Administration and Information Systems Management from the University of Central Florida.

About John

John Samuel, who joined CGS as its Global Chief Information Officer in 2016, was promoted to Executive VP in 2018, leading the company’s digital transformation to support its future expansion plans. With more than 20 years of progressive technology operations experience, he leads the global CGS technology teams, responsible for shaping the corporate digital strategy and overseeing IT initiatives, cybersecurity and implementation of productivity and process improvement tools.

Mr. Samuel has extensive experience in overseeing global technology, security and infrastructure. Most recently, he was Senior Vice President – Data Strategy, IT and Operations Infrastructure at Fareportal Inc., a global online travel agency and the parent company of brands such as Cheapoair.com and OneTravel.com. Mr. Samuel managed the Global shared services serving IT, Telephony and innovation, Work force management, Real-time mission control for contact centers, Data science and Data strategy. His teams were responsible for the IT infrastructure, operations, data centers, cloud, global network, telephony and contact center support throughout the globe. Mr. Samuel has extensive experience working with senior leadership to provide IT advice and guidance. His prior experience included many other senior leadership positions including COO of one of a kind private travel membership club. He graduated with a B.S. in Electrical Engineering and a minor in Computer Science & Information Systems from Manhattan College.

Check out CGS, say Hi to them on X (the social media platform formerly known as Twitter) @cgsinc, and do feel free to connect with Cathy and John on LinkedIn too.

Photo by Nadine Shaabana on Unsplash